Chapel Hill Shooting

I dunno, if someone was to steal my parking place on a regular basis I' d be pissed. The cops didn' t want to do squat about it when it happened to me, and if it keeps making you late for work you get real cranky real fast. I went with "kick their external rear mirror", but from what I' ve read the guy was a self-professed gun nut. And a wee bit short-fused too. Bad combo.

On a side-note, atheists can get quite a lot of flack in the US too. I mean the guy wasn' t exactly screaming "Pasta Akbar !" while going trigger happy, yet somehow the american news are doing their best at pretending they' re not totally insinuating the guy might be an anti-theist on a mission. Gee, could it be because atheistz eat babiez ?

 

I've seen both 'sides' get more than their fair share of flak from both the media and people in general.

 

I don' t want to turn this into a pity contest, but if you are to believe the latest poll (which isn' t the only one of its kind) Americans would rather vote for a 70 years old Muslim lesbian pot-smoker who cheated on her spouse than vote for an atheist. xD

Well anyway, I think divide and conquer is the basic tactic of all those Muslim terrorists we' ve heard so much about lately. They want us at each other' s throat, they want us to fill our echo chambers with paranoia. Ironically, Fow News might just be their greatest allies.

 

Surely, no "true" atheist would do such a thing as kill another person based on religion, right? I'm sorry, but the Rational Age of Atheism of Nietzsche, Douglas Adams, Christopher Hitchens, and, to some extent, Richard Dawkins is drawing to a close. A new generation is stepping in, and "rational" is taking on a new meaning. The more popular a group becomes, the more idiots that group will have; and you can't control what the next generation does. I regrettably scoff when it's noted the ex-wife is sure it couldn't have been a hate crime, because he champions human rights. That's fallacy. Oh, right. So do all Christians (Pedophilia in the church). So do all Muslims (Je Suis Charlie, non). So do all Jews (Watch as I casually point to the orphans and homeless of Palestine). So does everybody (History shows we've all been nothing but fantastic to each other). Well, it just tends to be "I will defend you, but you have to believe what I believe", but not always.

“I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.” - Voltaire

An Atheist said that. A brilliant Atheist. An Atheist whom, no matter who you are, you can agree with that. You don't have to prescribe to a whole new theology. That's the ideal. No matter what you believe. Respect (Not condescending forms of faux tolerance) is the key to peace.

Here's the real deal about whether or not this was a hate crime. It, in some sense, doesn't matter if it was or was not. It says a good deal in either case.

• Do all Atheists, whom haughtily called for Christians to denounce Christian terrorism after Christians called for all Muslims to denounce Islamic terrorism, denounce this killing? It doesn't matter if it's a hate crime. An Atheist killed three Muslim Young Adults. If a Christian did this, Christians would be doing what Atheists I've been seeing are doing, and vice versa. Christians would be hiding under a rock, saying, "That's not representative of all of us!" And the Atheists akin to this deplorable sack of skin in Chapel Hill would be fighting it tooth and nail, "This is your mind on Religion". Granted, many Christians were haughtily calling for ordinary citizens who can't do anything about ISIS directly. That is the trouble with indoctrination; the idea that bigotry becomes justified. But Atheists I have known will, with their own religious enthusiasm, take that as no one of them has ever done what religious people have done, theirs is the one Truth, the one Way, the, wait a freaking minute, this is starting to sound familiar.
• You do realize this is going to happen again, yes? This is not some Faux News pipe dream. Somebody with some set of ideals is going to kill someone else with a variation in their set of ideals. Sooner or later, the killer is going to be an Atheist and the victim is going to be a religious person, or, an Atheist who says, "Maybe they aren't diseased as you say. Maybe it makes no difference if they talk to the air, so long as they don't hurt anyone because "the wind talked back"." Motives may or may not be clear, and whether or not the killing was motivated by religious factors will vary. "Christian Man Kills Muslim Man For Sleeping With His Wife". There, that would a despicable means of ending another person's life, but one more emotionally "understandable" than "Dude, you stole my parking spot, and I have Anger Issues".

This may be begging the question, but fallacies abound anyway. Let's suppose ISIS did what it did and does what it does and they were asked why they do. Let's suppose they answer "Because, you see, they littered". Would anyone have to wonder if there's bullshitery there? Perhaps there might have been a better way of dealing with parking spot violators who were model citizens before getting a bullet in their heads. Bullet. In. The. Head. If you shoot someone in the head, there is no other way around it: YOU HATE THAT PERSON. Not specifically over faith grounds. I could find reasonable doubt if he had shot one of them in the head. One. That signifies it could have been a random shot. How do you land a Psycho Hat Trick like he did?

I find comfort that, were I to run into an Atheist leading his or her people down the same road religious people have crossed (Nobody expected the Spanish Inquisition), they wouldn't kill me over something silly like "Your faith does not align with mine". No, it would be something reasonable. Like parking spot disputes.

I am a Christian. A Catholic. Je suis Yusor, Deah, et Razan. And all that jazz. I'm a rational person. In fact, I kind of land more on the Agnostic Spectrum. I'm with anyone who wants to practice their religion and not hurt people; I do, in fact, classify Atheism as a faith, as it is a theology, and has sects (Take for example, Mr. **** Bag's (Sorry, does he have a name) self-proclaimed "Anti-Theism"). Being an anything does not exonerate a person to do what others have had the mistake of doing what many have done all throughout history. I really, REALLY hope this isn't the new norm. We do not need another age of "Glorious Revolution".

 

Yup, a Frenchman. Love that guy.

I' m genuinely confused at this point, are you speaking to me or is this a general rant ?
I' m not saying "true" atheists, whatever the hell that means, can' t be racist, or kill, or just be plain coocoo for cocoa puffs, they certainly can do that. And of ****ing course that guy is as much of an asshat as you could possibly get.

Well he hated their guts, that much is obvious. I was convinced at the first bullet.

Atheism is a lack of belief in any God. That' s it. Period. If you believe in a God, you' re doing it wrong. Atheism is an "ism" in name only because it holds no doctrine, no dogma. That being said, whatever else isn' t a god is totally fair game to believe in, no matter how far-fetched. I hear some Buddhists do qualify as atheists. Personally I don' t do religions period, but that doesn' t mean I' m apolitical. While I have no idea how Sir ******bag would have defined his anti-theism I do agree that it could completely qualify as an "ism" (hateful or not).

I can' t picture myself killing anyone for any other reason than self-defense, accident or stumbling into a battlefield, but I have an easier time picturing a neighborhood relationship starting on a horrible first impression and degenerating (which is drowsingly banal) in absurd proportions (which okay, is rarer) than a doof drunk on Dawkings. Not saying it can' t happen, it just doesn' t sound that likelier to me. But hey, just my two cents.

 

Ditto, mon amie. There's many Atheists in the Modern Era I have great respect for too. Stephen Fry is another particular favorite of mine. He can go a little Old Testament, as can Ricky Gervais at times, about trouncing organized religion; but they do so in a very intelligent way. Bill Maher has his moments. I feel he tries so hard to be modern Voltaire, when Christopher Hitchens has him beat by a long shot. My whole point though, in this discussion, is that these are not edgy ideas anymore. Fry's recent discussion on what he would say to God had a huge following and was widely lauded. Atheism is becoming popular. It's finally getting its chance. Big picture though: Popular can turn to fad really ****ing quick. I beat the censor to the punch by just typing an asterix four times.

It also has rules. Dogma. I'll get to that in a bit.

Well, to be honest, I did badly want to get your attention, specifically. Still, this nor that was a direct attack on you or your beliefs. The use of second-person tense in that phrase is to all readers, but you caught my attention since you brought up the plight of Atheists. A very true case. You're not burned at the stakes in as many countries as you used to be though. And that's great. But why bring it up here? The villain isn't Atheism. It's Atheism for the sake of Atheism. Self-serving Atheism. There's more a respect for Atheists in the media than you think.

Please, don't say rant. I'm not condemning your word choice, but, please, permit me to say any lengthy wordage is far too commonly regarded exclusively as either a pontificate or a rant. It isn't necessarily either. Rant has such a negative connotation in the world today. It feels, though not necessarily true of what you're saying, that one means to disregard what another has said.

True, you didn't say. It's blowing up everywhere though. See, Atheists have this funny thing about them where they are just as human as anyone else. They've paraded as the ones who never killed anyone for some time. They never had the chance, really. I never shot someone. I've also never held a gun in front of someone who, in theory, just tried to kill someone I cared about or succeeded in such an action. Get the picture? There's Atheists, if you don't prefer the term "Faddist", who have said "No Atheist would do such a thing as these religious people are doing". Then this North Carolina deal happens. "Well, then, no "True" Atheist would, since that goes against what we do as group and individually." That's, to side track, another advantage Atheism has. You can group up or go it alone. You don't need someone to remind you there's a nothing, because you never have to think about a nothing. But you do have groups. Atheists of America do great things. Hypocritical things. Unspeakable, hateful things. And great things for all of humanity. Much like every other organized religion on the Earth.

Now. Rationalize that. Who shoots someone in the head over a parking space? Not his. I believe it was the guest one. He's looking out for the community, huh? A community, which, according to quite a few people he shares it with, he hates. He's a very easy man to offend, as nearly everyone else who seems to know or have known him has said. Even his strongest enabler defender is saying he has Psychopathic tendencies.

He didn't just shoot the one he had a dispute with either. He shot his wife. Her sister. He killed without restraint. He made sure they were dead.

Spoiler

This is an image of the three victims. That is safe to click. They were still alive when that photo was taken. Look at how tall each of them is. Circumstantial evidence, but how did he manage to shoot all three of them in the head? Is he so good a marksman? Was this premeditated? This, truly is, begging the question. But, in questions, there lie answers. And this whole thing breaks my heart so much that I would love to know the answer.

Theism is the belief in a God or Gods. That's it. Period. They all diverted at some point. We all have wise men and manipulators. Sometimes both are in the same person. To say, Atheism is a name and nothing else, is doing an injustice to the people who live by it in a world that condemns them for merely questioning. It is an ideology. It also has Dogma. Granted, it's rules are a bit more hidden in social etiquette.

1. "If you subscribe to a religion, you likely were born into it. You wouldn't choose another religion. You don't really believe. It's silly." Example. I know plenty of Atheists who were raised Atheist. They believe it as ardently as any religious person does. Does this mean they too applied no thought to the selection of how they see things? Well, in a way, yes, because:
2. "Religion is silly. You talk to an imaginary friend, use it to serve a political agenda, justify your actions in wrong-doing, and disregard science." I hear this all the time. You just said yourself you're not apolitical. Sooner or later, somebody is going to use that to their advantage. So that somebody who is an Atheist can be controlled the same way everyone else ever has been. It's then that Science takes a back seat. I can't name a single major world religion that didn't have a scientific revolution era; they were bold, they discovered things, and with the supposition that as it worked, it was true. Genetics. Algebra. Loans. Either created or perfected by religious authorities.
3. "The world would be more peaceful if it were all Atheist." The world would be as relatively peaceful if it were Christian, Muslim, etc. The trouble has always been "Well, not everyone is. How do we get them to convert?" Give it a little time, and it's not going to seem so ridiculous or non-ordinary (You, by the above text, ascribe that it's not so much ridiculous as unusual for an Atheist to go Full Rapture) for religious people to live in justifiable fear of a group that wants to exterminate them. It's in an infancy, but Atheism is amassing its own group of bigots and sadists. There is but one goal: A cure. A cure to help all those sick people with the Mental Disease of being Deluded. It's not an irrational fear. It's something that is a visible seed, and history shows it's not going to be pretty. I'm not talking full-out genocide. It's plausible, yes, but not needed. A group of five can blow **** up without being a society, corporation, or society. I snicker when I hear "Imagine" sometimes. It's a beautiful song. But don't think things are going to be any different with "No religion too". I prefer to translate it into: "A world where what your religion is doesn't matter to anyone else. It is what it is, and that's it." It doesn't sync up as well to the verse.

Patman, I respect you and your two cents. It provides a dialogue. Everyone in the world has a problem surrounding how they choose to live their life. Ask yourself, would you be so cavalier if the tables were reversed? Muslim man kills three journalists...er... college students. All I wanted to do was see if you would do something besides just writing off the killer as crazy of his own accord. If he was and is, that just means it will still happen again. Whether or not there is doctrine in Atheism, we're watching a turning point. Monsters becoming bold. If he enlivens and inspires anyone to do as he has done for any reason, then it is then too late to turn back. Zola betrayed and turned into an evil priest inspiring hatred. Voltaire and Hitchens become Martyrs for Idealism. Essentially, I love Atheists, as I love humanity, and I fear its bastardization. It's happened before. It's happening now.

In our effort towards equality, we must all prevent what we can of creating, teaching, inspiring, or becoming the next generation of bigots. No one is saying Atheists eat babies. Well, it's possible, babies are delicious, ever tried veal? This is the irrational thinking of people who do not understand anything past the tip of their nose. We can all easily turn into that person. I used to be that person. So, inversely, we can all turn into the opposite of those people if we happen to be them to begin with. You'd never know it until you step out of its grip.

Anti-Theism is a theism. So is the KKK. So is ISIS. It's the inherent idea that "I am right, you are wrong, subscribe to my religion now or be a fool or a dead fool."

 

Mon ami. I' m a man. ^^
Whether Voltaire actually said that is dubious by the way, though he did write something quite similar.

It' s been steadily popular for nearly three centuries here. Thanks to Voltaire (and more). That, and secularism, which the recent events have easily propelled as our hands down favorite republican value in the polls.

Well we' re clearly not burned at the stake here, I' m not complaining. I brought it up here because those topics have captured my attention for quite a while and the recent events cranked it up to eleven. Honestly I don' t think I' m done digesting. I did leave that thought in a side-note though.

I might make it easy to forget, I don' t know, but please bear in mind English isn' t my first language. I do what I can. ^^

You really gotta stop equating ideologies with religions.
The only thing that makes me think of is youtube' s comment section. Doesn' t have to be atheists, youtube will do.
Are American atheists really spouting that around in real life ? There' s no Atheists of France group. Nor prominent atheist club I can think of. We' re not a minority and we' re not persecuted.

Does it take being that good of a marksman ? I wouldn' t know. I' m not sure what premeditation has to do with the motives though.

Err ... sorry but nope. Can' t follow you there. English might not be my first language, but you' re twisting the dictionary a little too much for my taste here. I' m sure local generalizations can be made, but I think it' d be dishonest to call that a dogma. And if they' re the ones calling it a dogma (which would amaze me) tell them Patman said they can go **** themselves.

1 - I was born into Catholicism. I' m an atheist now. If there' s an egg, where' s the chicken ?
2 - Irrational would be more like it. Which yeah, silly pretty much covers it. But hey, I don' t need people not to think any of my beliefs are silly to talk to them. Or even befriend them. I' m pretty sure there' s at least one person out there who thinks I' m the crazy one. Besides I am admittedly quite silly at times.
3 - I' m not so sure about it. I certainly wouldn' t mind trying, but I wouldn' t bet on us ever getting there.

Cavalier ... am I ? As in being dismissive or carefree ? Look, I suck with the social niceties, especially the ones expected in the US. That won' t be news to Roxam. But trust me, I care.

Wait, how do you know they' re supposed to taste like veal ? That' s suspiciously accurate. xD
I' ve been told three times on this very forum that atheists have no morals. Poe' s law applies I guess, but I' m honestly not sure they were trolls.
Not that this is keeping me up at night or haunting me when I type here, it really doesn' t. Lately it' s that kind of news that keeps me up at night.

 

Hey, @Patman , I'm rather enjoying the exchange here. Unfortunately, I'm in the middle of moving (Oddly enough, to North Carolina) and today's the day.

I totally said the right version. You just THINK you heard an e. Heard? No, ****, that was read. ****. OH! That was in your head. Yeah, Uhhh, I was writing phonetically. Okay, you caught me, I done screwed up. Dernit, I was just trying to be friendly, 'cuz:

Here's the deal. I can communicate with you. That's wonderful. And getting rarer. I'm pretty much playing Socrates here, and that's it. I'm seeing a lot of hatred over here, and I'm really sorry if you're getting any of it. You don't seem too bad. For a dirty, dirty heretic. Naughty lad.

Apply how you know Christians practice Christianity in America to how Atheists practice Atheism in America, and you have a very similar group. It's not about logic in this case. It's about being a part of another collective. It's about "Somebody told me this was illogical, boom, logic bomb, logic, logic, logic." It is turning into a religion. It used to be a philosophy. Now, it's theology. Believe me, I'm not getting my wires crossed. A Modern Atheist is crying for their religious freedom when being hypercritical just as often as anybody else. I would, actually, vote for an Atheist though. Were they a member of Atheists of America though, that might hurt their chances with me. It'd be the same as voting in any other hate group with a political agenda.

http://thecolbertreport.cc.com/videos/a6f94j/cross-controversy-at-9-11-museum

Sorry that I can't embed that video in the discussion. If it's not available in your country, here's the Spark Notes: Atheists are as easy to offend in America as any other group. They justify anything they do by saying "Well, we do nice things for the community every once in a while." You know, while teaching the philosophy that organized religion is the devil. Bill Maher is a prophet, admittedly, accidentally. I like him, but there's so many hanging on every word he says like he's, coincidentally, a messiah. There's no god to it, really. Would kind of make the hypocrisy too blatant. Logic is dying in it too. It's becoming presumptions. Like the examples I mentioned. Those REALLY exist. I'm not kidding.

Now, don't be fooled. Not all Christians over here want to blow up a Planned Parenthood. Not all Muslims want to bring America to its knees. Not all Atheists are yuppies paving the path for future intolerance, which made groups like previously mentioned; the ones in other religions. Keep in mind, it's these radicals that tend to be more traitorous to their Holy Books when meaning to keep to it. Because someone manipulated them. I don't think I'm educating you of this point. There is some general-ness in my little rant. Yes, I used that word on purpose: Just to bring up: Wow, your English is good. Sorry if I've seemed a bit long-winded; I'm not normally concise on Philosophy. When you look at something from every possible vantage point, detail is key.

That's what needs to be pointed out here: It's been working up for a while now on these shores. Sheep. Atheist sheep. With a coalition. I understand that it's reasonable to go with Innocent until proven guilty. It's also important to point out: there is a new kind of sensationalism, and they are a threat to everyone. Especially Atheists. Mofos makin' people like you look bad. This is not an isolated incident. And it's not just Atheists.

"my sisters 1st grade classroom is predominately muslim students and none of them showed up today and when she called their parents to see if they were okay they said they were too afraid to send their kids to school. so dont sit here and tell me this is an isolated incident."~ filthy****ingmouths from Tumblr​

Take everything with a grain of salt. Hey, maybe she's lying. Just don't assume the "Troublemaker parking lot" angry guy isn't. That is a general notion, not at Patman. You have Atheists defending the murderer the same way white people defended Darren Wilson.

 

Oh well, break a leg ! I think you' ve managed to make your point by now.
The e is silent. Not that I care about that faux-pas one bit, I just couldn' t pass the opportunity to tease you. xD

Okay that was ... embarrassing. With a capital E. I don' t exactly hold Bill Maher as an intellectual (even I can see the stupid here and there, that' s not a good sign), he' s just a decent humorist to me. If memory serves Christopher Hitchens called out Bill' s audience on its sheepishness at least once. I barely know Silverman, but I' m surprised and appalled to see him stoop that low. The ones I hear the most are the bunch from the Atheist Experience, they have their blunt moments but they look rather level-headed to me.

I' m not surprised to hear you' d vote for an atheist though, I had gathered that much by now.