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Freedom of speech is something people take for granted constantly. Many people forget that it just means that the government will not punish you for speaking out against issues and that what you say normally should not earn you retaliation in another manner than speech back or basic public separation. It does not mean that if you say something abhorrent or extreme, that others cannot respond, complain, or do some counter-speech against the behavior, or choose to ignore you utterly, or affect your monetary income as they can choose to not purchase things from you, etc. It does mean that the people cannot respond aggressively such as beating the tar out of the person for said thing or sue you, toss you in jail, etc.

I've countered quite a few comments I believe are 'stupid' such as when some guy came to our college and spoke on how women should dress better (not in what he viewed as smutty attire) because men can't help themselves and that men ought to pray to God to control their sexual urges. I told him that how a woman dresses is never an excuse for rape, regardless and that if a man feels the desire to have sex, he can solve that in a few ways and if he's a rapist, he needs -real- help; not the girls. I also said that it was time he modernized and if he couldn't, he should move to some country where women are forced to wear clothing that meets his specs because the rules of the land weren't changing for his kind. Needless to say, a few people including him were mad at me for my cutting in on his great speech. Others applauded me. I took some criticism and some cheer. Did I know the risks of interrupting him? Yes. Did I feel what I did was morally what I felt I should? Yes. So I did it. I've since then had some comments back that I was either an a-hole or I was dead on right. Taking offense to the negative comments seems so trivial in the end if you are also going to enjoy the positive feedback in what is said. It's their right to call me whatever, just as it was my right to cut in on what I felt was an idiotic comment in the first place.

In the end, understanding that Freedom of Speech does not mean you can say whatever with no repercussions at all is very important. It means that if you are going to speak out or post something controversial, that you need to grow some thick skin and have reasons for it. It means that whiners also need to do the same instead of going on about PC all the time and hiding behind it for protection. There is seldom an issue where we all agree on the words said. Someone is always going to be offended, it seems, whenever there is a good group of people around. We are all opinionated. If you say something that can spark controversy, expect that it may not be well-favored. That way you aren't in for disappointment when it is ill-received. We recognize the rights that anyone has the right to be offended by something said. However, they must realize the rights too that their emotions aren't more important than anyone else's either. If they don't, too bad. Walk on and let them say whatever.

There is a point in saying everyone is not equal. We simply aren't, except by defined 'rights' which are given to us by society. TMM has a point. However, to say that the 'male whole gender' is superior to the 'female whole gender' or vice versa, is basically ignorant. It's the same as saying someone of one ethnicity is superior to another. Group generalizations tend to fail often.

In gym class, surely people know we aren't all made equal. Some people can run faster, lift more, play a better game of basketball, can take more punishment physically etc. In classes otherwise, there are those that are extremely gifted with a great memory and others who can't remember a math formula to save their lives, those who can spell better, have better grammar, can comprehend certain classes better than others, etc. This division is not based necessarily on just one component. If it seems so, sometimes it is also because of how an individual is raised.

Genetics as well as environment play factors in how well people will do, but also there is determination too. All three components determine how successful we can be at things and it allows some to excel at certain things while others are going to suck at those things. Whether male or female, if the person is not into doing physical activities, is pain sensitive, and hates to sweat, or has some injury, and is raised to be gentle and not enjoy sports etc, the person is not going to excel at sports. Male or female, if the person does not apply him/herself to school work, finds it difficult to study, doesn't care, or has a poor memory capacity, is closed-minded, has some mental disorder that isn't addressed etc, that person is going to not do well in classes. We all simply are not equals in what we can do. Equality comes from saying that we all have the intelligence capable of doing something with our lives and that we have the right to vote, drive, marry, have relationships, get jobs, etc. There simply will always be those who are extremely gifted and who will use what they have to excel. There also will be those who are not so gifted but work their butts off to be great anyway because they push what they have to the extreme. Then there are those who won't barely even try, whether they have the talents or not.

In the end, I suppose any deity not born or evolved on earth would be an alien. In a way, that would be the other reason why I wouldn't consider 'worship' that important to any deity anyway. The concept of worshiping some being that's just an alien, albeit a super powerful one, seems silly to me. Also, as said somewhere else... if God did exist, he'd have a lot of esplainin' to do.

Been busy, but around here. Don't usually like msn so I don't use it as much since my computer is giving me a hard time lately about it. Hope all...

I've read the Bible numerous times and well, it's probably the main reason I am not a Christian, though certainly some people, with how they act, certainly deter me from that path as well. I was raised Christian, but when I first sat down at 13 and read the Bible, I have to say it opened my eyes. The painted lovely benevolent God that was shown to me in church school was not the same one I read about. I probably never would have bothered with the book and just would have gone on naively with what was taught to me in church school had I also not stumbled on a book on The Crusades and thought the whole thing was the most outlandish and barbaric thing I'd ever read. It even beat out Edgar Allan Poe's collection book I was reading for how scared it made me. I'll also note that during and after reading The Bible through, I had the worst nightmares for a few years about the end of the world and for some reason, I had a front seat on a mountain to watch it all. I was not happy. xD

To get to the point of the debate though, to me, Yahweh is outdated and that is why Jesus had to be made. He was a violent god that punished people, ordered the deaths of people in cities and used others to accomplish his goals. He tested out people's loyalties in a way that most of us today would think were outlandish, such as telling Job to kill his son and then at the last second revoking it. Also, some of the tales were just really out there. As a kid I could believe them. As an adult, I can't, and if I did choose to believe them, I'd demand an apology from Yahweh for his mistreatment of humans for all these years.

For example, Adam and Eve. Why put a tree that is forbidden to eat from in a lush garden of beauty and love with animals of peace and two humans that are childish in mentality? Why have it there in the first place so that Lucifer can tempt Eve, who then says 'why not', eats it and then goes off to share with her husband? Would a parent leave out a bunch of cookies on a table that look great and smell delicious and tell a 5 year old not to eat the cookies, and replace them each day with new cookies that smell and look scrumptious and yet the kid is told the same thing? On the same note, if an older friend comes by the house and says 'it's ok to take a cookie' and the kid does after some convincing and it's found to be absolutely as delicious as they had hoped, if she takes another for her friend or sibling, and shares it, is she being bad? I'd say the parent was really kind of cruel for putting the cookies there and never offering any to the child. Also, I'd say if the parent knows this other guy coming over is kind of a jerk and would tempt the kids more, that this person shouldn't -be there-. Who gets punished though? The kids. Adam and Eve get told they are now mortal, Eve must bear pain in child birth and have periods, Adam is told he's in charge of Eve because she's basically stupid, so that starts off the males are superior to females deal.

Let's go on to Job. He nearly kills his own child, despite the pain of losing his son, all because God wants him to, in order to test his loyalty. Let's say you are a parent of a kid and some mafia guy wants you to show your loyalty to the family by killing your child. Or some king wants you to kill your child? Or some gang member? Or some grand parent? .. When God is 'humanized', this crime is rather hideous. Of course, it can be noted that the son lived, but really, that's a cop out and I'd still be really mad to have someone forced into such a thing. There are women that have had to kill their children for years because men weren't happy with them. There are men and women that were ordered to kill their children by higher authorities. Some may have been calls that were taken back and the parents were grateful, but really, was the pain needed in the first place?

Noah's tale became one that grew a lot worse too. Apparently, to rid the world of the evil and the fact the world was not how God wanted it, he found the one group of people he would spare, had the guy build an ark, made a giant storm and raised the waters to cleanse the earth, and all to get rid of other humans who were not what he wanted. How cruel. That's no different to me than someone dropping a nuke about now to wipe out a city or nation because the people are 'bad' and not thinking about the ones who aren't. I find it hard to believe the whole of life on the Nile etc was so horrible that all those people deserved death. (Let alone apparently around the world according to the Bible).

And onto attacking cities in the name of Yahweh. Because they were different. And attacking others of other cultures in smaller settlements. The men there that were victorious, Yahweh apparently felt it was right to kill all of the men, kill many children and women, take virgins or the good looking women for wives through forced marriages and rape them, because women were just tools for bearing children. We have a Geneva Convention today for a reason. To stop the extra brutality that happens during wars. This behavior also happened in the Crusades, as people that weren't Christian were considered pagans and therefore beneath them. Of course, then many women weren't married but instead just raped and murdered.

I could go on and on about how Yahweh today would not fit right with the way society is. We are a bond of gentler societies today who gets mad if we see others abusing members of their societies poorly, whether for religious reasons or not. Of course, in saying this, I will also note that Christianity is hardly the only religion to have such a bloody past and Yahweh is hardly the only god that can be attributed to have been used as an excuse to kill in droves, encourage rape, murder, seizure of land, sabotage etc. The difference though is most of those religions are now reduced to being known as mythologies and were wiped out by Christianity and Islam. Those that survive today do so with a few scant members or the religions themselves grew to be more peaceful as societies also did so.

In saying that, Christianity too had to do the same thing and evolve, as did Islam. Jesus was a way to make the religion more kindly. Some of the saints were also kinder, such as St. Francis and how he walked about and was kind to both humans and animals, giving animals more recognition than they had ever had formerly. We've seen some incredible cruelty still, sure, but it's not as bad as it was and still the influence of the Old Testament reared its head, even in the times when people were trying to make Christianity less bloody. The Inquisitions, cleansing of 'pagans', the Crusades, the way the Spanish dealt with the Aztecs and Mayans, the way the Puritans and Protestants dealt with the Native Americans, etc. Today, we still see violence motivated on by using religion as an excuse. We can see cultures oppressed by religions but again, is it as bad as the Dark Ages, where saying anything against God could get you murdered in some hideous way?

So, in the end, the God of yesterday was definitely not a God that today should be to me held in sacrosanct. Christianity had to adapt and still does as we change in our views on violence and what is an inexcusable crime versus what isn't. It's the reason it survives today. To many Christians, Yahweh is a kinder deity that would never do such things as was shown in the Old Testament. Many Christians don't even read the Old Testament and though violence and such can be found in the New Testament as well, the portrayal of Jesus himself as a martyr, who died for the sins of mankind and did benevolent acts of healing, roaming around and talking, was kind to a prostitute, liked children etc, is what most Christians try to use as a guideline for modeling themselves after. The 10 Commandments themselves are not so great, but the way today it is taught is different than how it was intended, and even Jesus said he stood by the 10 Commandments of old. However, these have been shortened to mean different things today than they did back in his time.

Christianity is a mutating thing and has absorbed other cultures into it as well. Christmas is not Jesus's birthday. It's Horus's and a few other deities' and also is Winter Solstice or Yule. It was a celebrated holiday long before Jesus came about. In order to make it easier to not have to war with 'pagans' however, the holiday was taken up and altered. The same with Easter. Easter is even a goddesses' name. So there's the other reason Christianity thrives. It adapted to permit things of other cultures to be done on holidays that weren't there's to begin with, and as long as the people taken over could have some of their former cultures still intact, rather than fighting, they ended up accepting it. So, though the old Yahweh certainly doesn't fit in today's societies though some people definitely still do try to make it so, Christianity has evolved, absorbed and changed and continues to do so today with its many factions so that somehow it survives and goes on. Some groups are more violent than others and less tolerable. Some are more peaceful and giving. And there are quite a few people that are independent of organizations who believe in God in their own way, which is what many Deists do or Christians that wish to be free of organized religion. Some Christians and Deists pretty well declare that the Bible is rubbish and written by man, so therefore is full of errors. Mythril Roxas is not the only Deist also that I've heard say that the God in the Bible is presumed to be Satan. We all have our views.

Many religions, including Christianity had sacrifices and such in the older times. Today, we still have lingering martyrs in monotheistic religion, so the encouragement to do something for a deity that is of great sacrifice still is around, though most people frown on it. There are also cases of murders that happen because some zealots believe their children being gay or something against their religion is bad enough to merit death.

Ever since I was thirteen, I've not liked organized religions really of any kind, though I do understand them and have studied them quite exclusively. Organized religions to me seem to be a tool used to control society, set structure and also grant some people power and authority over others they consider weaker. Kings of various kinds have even used it as a means of holding power and those lords who went against religion or adapted new religions suffered for it with death or were made into icons for the deed. We can learn a lot about any culture through examining religion, amongst other things, both in present and in the past.

As for why would many ancient religions believe in sacrificing of life, it's not that they were stupid. The older cultures were explorers studying life and death, medicines, war, famine, disease, etc. However, they also had, in some areas, little to go off of. They were ignorant; not stupid. We're still ignorant and do what we can with what we have, though more advanced now. They didn't know what to do with some extreme situations. The gods of older times, to include monotheistic figures in Judaism, Islam and Christianity, but also others such as Norse, Celtic, Greek, Roman, Egyptian, Mayan, Hindu, Aztec, Babylonian, Mesopotamian etc, were deities that were involved in human lives. People believed these gods were influential and could punish them for wrong doings and that some even warred against each other, forcing humans to take sides or be punished for it. If you blame a famine on a god who has a bad temper, how do you quell that god's rage so you can again eat and grow produce? A sacrifice to the god may seem pretty logical at that point since you want to appease the deity and hope for the best. If nothing is done, you can hope another deity will come in and save you but sometimes with the older religions, it was felt necessary that humans do at least something to cater to the whims of the gods, rather than just being mere followers. That's where we get our old mythological heroes from. They stood against the adversity of 'bad' deities or other figures such as the fae and dragons etc.

As for the other part of your debate issue, that Yahweh in the First Testament is hard to see as a 'spirit' sort of being, well that is a personal thought and hard to debate. To me, some of the ancient religious deities were much more like 'people' than Yahweh was. Jesus, who's life mirrors Horus as well as some other deities, seemed to bring about that personal connection and human connection to Yahweh that was lacking formerly. Before Jesus, the manifestations of God were through other people such as Moses calling on his power, or through people being told to do deeds such as Noah building the ark, or through some sort of show of power and voice such as the burning bush. There were trials of loyalty such as with Job. However, you never really in the Old Testament, -see- Yahweh. Instead you hear his voice, see his power either by his own acts of turning up nature as was done with the Egyptians, or he used individuals to have the power work through. Hope this is even making sense. xD

So, to me, Yahweh was more like Brahma in that people could see it as a being connected to life and death but its so grand it won't be seen in flesh and blood. That would make it more of a 'spirit' to me than the other deities of the time who even if some had extraordinary appearances, still allegedly showed themselves to humanity. The pantheon deities of older times were more human and tangible with actual human issues as well such as having extra-marital affairs, cheating, lying, stealing, loving, hating, had romance, loved to have combat, etc. They matched in a way more up to how humans of the times felt. Some were very benevolent and loving. Others were cruel and sadistic. Some were warriors while others were healers, etc. They embodied what the cultures felt were aspects of humanity itself, as well as what was important to humans to survive.

Yahweh did have some human qualities such as jealousy, anger, a desire to kill the infidels, to protect his people, etc, but at the same time, he was always considered to be well above everything and not so tangible. Jesus as well as some other beings of notable importance such as Mohammad, Abraham, David, Moses etc, were figures that brought God to be more understood. Jesus being his son and yet also an aspect of Yahweh, showed a gentler side of the god since times were changing and made the religion obviously in some ways more appealing. Mohammad was obviously as instrumental for Islam, and both religions now are the two major ones of the world, whereas before, they were not as major influences.

I can't say I believe in any religion, but I do find them intriguing to study. I've seen some weird things but either they can be explained by science or I figure the answer someday will come to be revealed. As for aliens assuming roles of either Yahweh or any other deity, I leave that alone since well, I haven't ever seen a bonified alien yet. We humans have an incredible gift for imagination, so right now I am under the impression that people, to express phenomenon they did not understand and also to control masses of people in some fashion, made up a lot of things.

Hmm, going on just a purely physical side of things, I can say that I'd rather look at the average girl with a decent face and body than to be looking at one that has either a gorgeous face or body. It would seem weird to me to see someone who has a really hot face or bod and yet the other is countering it. It kind of would make me wonder, unless I could tell something bad happened like scarring or burns, as to why the person doesn't try to make the other thing to look nicer too. Most people to me don't seem 'ugly' in features unless they seem to be trying for it, such as they don't take baths or let themselves go.

The most important thing to me, for some reason, tends to be the eyes of a person, so I guess I'd have to say face is more important, but I also check out how the female dresses and is she clean, how does she stand, and does she seem to care about herself and others; not just her appearance, but her actual self.

I think the girl deserved some punishment, but the jail thing seems kind of extreme to me. She'll probably end up having it worse for years to come as the picture gets distributed around and she gets a stupid rep that she will have to live with until she can move on out of school. I wouldn't blame the schools for this behavior and well, probably not parents either in most circumstances. Teenagers just do things. We all know it. xD

It -is- child pornography though and well, if she doesn't care about her own safety, someone else has to. She's showing that she's immature. I have no idea why kids, or adults for that matter, want to send naked pictures of themselves out to others anyway really because the moment someone gets mad at you, what do they do with the pic? They post it up somewhere with nasty comments so that others can see and it tends to get around so that everyone thinks bad things about the person. There's a smaller chance that it will also attract some idiots who will then go to plaguing the person who took the pic. Would you post a nude pic on your school wall? Probably not because everyone would think you were trampish and stupid. So kids shouldn't be sending naked pics of themselves to others over a phone either or computer for that matter.

In the end, to send a picture like that is to risk a lot in self-respect and just causes pain. I could really care less if an adult does it, though when I hear them whine because suddenly the naked pic is up for the world to see, I laugh at them. Some people like to show off their bodies so the repercussions to them don't matter and that's all fine. It's their choice and they can live with it because they either don't care or they don't want to think of things until after they've done them. However, will a young teenager know the repercussions? Probably not so keenly as adults don't tend to tell them what those can be, so I have a bit more mercy on them. It's a mistake to do that can hurt the kid for some while. So teens should be told that sending pics of themselves naked can lead to embarrassment, harassment, sexual predators, and just it's a mistake that is likely not able to be undone or forgotten about for some time. Maybe the image of some 50 year old guy at a computer jerking off to a teen's pic found online might shake some reality into some people.

Males and females, to me, can't so easily be divided into what they are 'good' at just because of a gender issue. Though men can easier gain muscle mass for strength and women tend to be more flexible and dexterous, it's not always the case and I've seen plenty of dexterous men and muscular women. Also, by genetics, men born to a couple will tend to be taller while the women will be shorter. However, over the years, with couplings as they have been, females have grown considerably taller and I see some that are quite a bit taller than me and I'm 6'1.

Physically and mentally there are also large differences between males themselves or females themselves. I can see men who aren't active, who aren't what anyone would consider particularly smart and who can't seem to survive on their own. I see this with women too. There are traits people who love stereotypes try to apply to one gender that I see in both, such as passive aggressive behavior, guilting the other gender, abusiveness, caring about appearance, hating oneself, arrogance, gender bias, cheating, stubbornness, being dependent, over-emotional, drama-queens, selfish, etc. There are chemical differences in males and females, but obviously not as many as people think when it comes to adaptation to environments.

We aren't all the same, but I just cannot feel that people can safely determine how a male or female will turn out just because of the gender of the person. With the freedom of women happening, more women have shown they are very capable, thinkers, and can do many things that were typically at one time thought to be a man's duties. Also, with women's freedoms, men have also shown that they can learn and enjoy doing activities that were formerly assigned to women and do them well. In the end, there are thinkers, athletes, martial artists, scientists, teachers, cooks, etc of both genders and those that excel shouldn't be considered great by gender, but instead greatly gifted as a human being. Then there are those males and females who are not so productive with their lives and/or are unable to find their niches in society.

So, in the end, I consider males and females on the whole as humans and that there are some out of both genders who excel and then there's the vast majority of us that do alright, and then there's the other part where all are male and female jokes and stereotypes come from. We're all pretty equal in that regard.

Ah! Hey there. How's it going?

As usual, with the hype surrounding the singers, everything is exaggerated and the full truth is not known. People can speculate but it's really just another domestic dispute and these things happen often. Whatever transpired, both stars will probably have their chances to explain and whether charges happen or not, that's up to someone other than us to decide. Whatever happened, they both seemed to be in a heated issue and bad temperament and well, to me that's between the two of them. Rihanna will be fine. I'm just glad that no one was hurt worse, and being who they are, there is actual help out there and a resolution that neither has to be with one another because they both actually have money etc.

I do hear what some people say about 'who cares because there's a lot of suffering that goes unnoticed' but while I get sick of the glam showy intrusive people into stars' lives etc, I do think it helps if we do see they have some troubles as it does sometimes make people pay more attention to those around them too. The thing here I find that is irritating is that people are bothering to speculate what happened since no one knows. Some people will take this speculation as fact and it's lame.

Eat a Snickers bar.

Darwin ruled. Happy Darwin Day! ~

They get closed out due to no activity after a while. maybe some of us can get together and work on a new one that will last a bit longer.

I like both Riku and Riku Replica. They both had a crummy deal in that situation. At least Riku was attentive and felt bad too, staying to talk to him. Sora was nice to him too. He had his mind messed with a lot and things could have been different.

I'm going to ask that this either gets back on topic or it will be closed. Please stop the arguing and if there are problems, let me or another member of staff know instead of arguing. Debate, don't fight guys. :)

I'm going to close this thread since it has turned into a flame fest. However, I will say that Dr Mythril Roxas, you need to learn to treat people with more respect around here. You weren't regarded as a person that was ignorant until you started dissing others and treating them rudely, while spewing out 'facts' that have little foundation to them.

This is an area where 'intelligent' discussion happens. Mocking others, telling them how they should feel etc is not intelligent. Also, complaining about dereps is not permitted on the site and if you wish to have it investigated, you should have read the rules where it says rather clearly to PM a staff member to investigate if the dereps are earned or not.

Consider this my nice warning that the Discussion area is not going to turn into a place where people will actually -fight- over religion or other matters. Members can discuss things, debate, etc but shouldn't be putting one another down for their viewpoints. If you can't do that, don't post in these sorts of topics anymore. I will hope your next posts will be more mature and follow the guidelines here. As for the rest of you guys, if someone is doing this kind of thing, send me or another staffer a PM so we can close the topic or remove the troublemaker. Don't feed the troll, as the saying goes.

We'd just go hit on women at some bar instead.

This goes in Spam Zone. Moving it there.

Well, it is his petition. heh